An Interview with Drag Queen Kim Chi and Youtube Chef Jon Kung

Kim Chi’s TikTok is @kimchieats. Not “Kim Chi does make-up,” not “Kim Chi from RuPaul’s Drag Race,” however Kim Chi, the drag queen and entrepreneur, eats. She eats Chipotle and cooks Korean beef radish stew. She sums up her consuming adventures whereas touring the world, and even partnered with Imodium and Pepcid AC for some gastrointestinal realness. So when she approached her good friend chef Jon Kung of YouTube’s Kung Meals about doing a podcast collectively, may it have been about something however meals?

Kim Chi and Kung’s new podcast, 1 for the Desk, is like hanging out with two pals who’ve the most effective restaurant ideas. They discuss in regards to the significance of rice throughout cultures and hating licorice desserts, the variations between positive eating in New York and LA, and nearly all fascinating issues they’ve needed to eat just lately. They’re humorous and opinionated, and most of all curious. As Kung says, the 2 of them are the sort to strive something not simply as soon as however twice.

Largely, they each wished an opportunity to speak about meals much more than they already do. However in addition they wished to have a good time how a ardour for meals can come from wherever; you don’t need to be an knowledgeable to like or discuss it. We spoke to Kim Chi and Kung in regards to the similarities between Korean and Chinese language cultures, the few dishes they’ve a tough time consuming, and if there may be such a factor as queer meals.

Eater: How did you two meet?

Kim Chi: Jon and I first met at Motor Metropolis Pleasure in 2016. I used to be in my dressing room and Jon really stumbled in drunk together with his good friend. Later the promoter requested me, “Would you like me to take you out to dinner at a restaurant or do you need to have a personal chef prepare dinner for you?” I used to be like, “Oh, I’ll get the personal chef to prepare dinner for me.” The chef was really Jon. He then went to Complete Meals, I consider?

Jon Kung: I didn’t really conform to do it, however my greatest good friend agreed for me. The subsequent factor I keep in mind was him driving me to Complete Meals the place we spent 45 minutes purchasing for substances. Presently, there was a state of affairs the place I used to be the one particular person in my whole constructing and the constructing consisted of 4 residences and I had entry to all of them. I just about used each single kitchen in every condominium to whip up this four- or five-course meal for Kim in like an hour.

Have been you continue to drunk at this level?

JK: I sobered up by the point I bought dwelling as a result of it’s like, you get into prepare dinner mode: We’re fairly infamous for working beneath intense circumstances. By that point I used to be positive, and Kim got here in and we bonded over the meals, and it was a pleasant little expertise. Then one factor led to a different the place Kim, you got here down and ate possibly one or two extra occasions since you had gigs within the metropolis. Then you definately invited me to go to P-City? We went to Provincetown collectively and it seems we have been actually good journey buddies. Provincetown become Joshua Tree after which a tremendous journey to Taiwan. After which I assume we realized we have been pals.

You talked about within the podcast notes that you just two all the time wind up speaking about meals while you’re collectively. What was the impetus for the podcast?

JK: We had spent a while on the highway, and observed that we have been all the time speaking about meals or something linked to meals. Then as soon as, out of the blue, Kim talked about the podcast.

KC: The stuff we discuss is sort of academic, so why don’t we put in a podcast type and see if folks prefer it? We now have our combo: Folks love Jon’s content material on TikTok, Instagram, and YouTube. I’ve followers which are all the time like, “Oh, I really like your mukbang, I like what you do with the meals.” I used to be like, “All proper, it feels pure to do a podcast.”

You’ve targeted on East Asian cuisines and cooks. What conversations round these cuisines do you’re feeling have been lacking from most of the people?

JK: I really feel like we’re two those that have the same lived expertise, though ethnically we’re utterly completely different, and have been raised in another way. Our love for meals is what unifies us. So far as who’s having that dialog, it appears like there aren’t that many foodies who appear to be us. I imply, except you’re super-hyper-established like David Chang.

Kim and I’ve a chance to journey, we’re each extraordinarily adventurous, however on the identical time, we’re not likely out to do something however take pleasure in ourselves and share that love with folks. Meals podcasts will not be straightforward to do as a result of in the end it’s a reasonably limiting matter. However we managed to develop to different elements of our personal cultures and identities.

KC: I believe our purpose with the podcast is to to not be simply one other podcast that talks about roast hen in gravy, but in addition discuss the best way meals connects with folks and the best way folks can relate to meals, and possibly even unearth the generational trauma that comes with our meals.

I need to get into that, as a result of within the conversations round Asian American and second-generation Asian id, meals is handled as inseparable from that id. Why do you assume that’s?

KC: For Koreans, once they see their pals, the very first thing they are saying is, “Have you ever eaten but?” If you find yourself grown adults, the best factor you are able to do is go and get a meal with one another. Time simply goes by in case you’re sharing a meal and having a dialog over it. Meals can also be one factor that everyone has an opinion on, whether or not you prefer it or not. It’s a simple option to relate to folks and it’s a simple option to get an perception into an individual’s psyche.

JK: In Chinese language tradition we additionally ask, “Have you ever eaten but?” even instead of different phrases similar to, “I really like you.” In Asian American communities — particularly locations the place you don’t have giant populations of Chinese language folks — there are a number of conditions the place, in all this detachment from that larger tradition, meals is your solely connection. Lots of people really feel very strongly about these items as a result of typically that’s their solely window into this a part of themselves. I name a number of the meals I make Chinese language meals, nevertheless it challenges what Chinese language American meals is. I get a number of pushback from Chinese language folks, like, “That isn’t the meals my grandmother made.” I’m like, “Nicely, what? The meals that your grandmother made won’t have been good.”

I’d love to speak a bit of bit extra about positioning yourselves as public opinion-havers on meals when so typically the reactions will be, “Nicely, how have you learnt what you’re speaking about? What’s your background? How dare you even recommend that what my grandmother made, that there may be a special option to make that?”

KC: Earlier than I used to be doing drag and all of the glamorous issues I’m doing now, I labored in quick meals. I labored as a barista. I labored as a sandwich maker at a manufacturing facility. I’ve labored in positive eating for a few years. I really feel like I positively have a voice and a number of my followers are all in favour of listening to it.

JK: We’re each the kind of folks that may strive one thing and if we don’t prefer it, we’ll strive it once more to ensure. And if we nonetheless don’t prefer it, we’ll strive the identical factor once more made by another person to simply be doubly certain. I don’t assume both of us can title a dish that we can not respect indirectly, as a result of we’ve been on the receiving finish of getting our meals bashed indirectly. Having skilled that, we’re extra all in favour of gassing up different cultures’ meals as a result of there’s a lot to like. Really essentially the most wonderful, pornographic factor is to take heed to Kim discuss meals.

Is there any meals both of you began off not liking and have come to understand extra?

KC: For me, it’s meals made with anchovies. Rising up, I used to be like, “That sounds gross.” However now that I’ve grown up, anchovies are one in all my go-to pizza toppings. The salty, fishy style paired with the salty cheese and tomato sauce: chef’s kiss. Each time I made pasta at dwelling after I was younger, I used to be simply throwing in marinara or a jar of creamy sauce. However now do extra of an oil-based pasta dish the place I soften the anchovies with some garlic and chile flakes after which simply toss pasta in it. Quite simple, however so flavorful and good.

JK: I believe the primary points I’ve had with meals have been your typical childhood icks — something fishy, something bitter. One taste profile that I’ve the toughest time with, as a result of I’ve bought a very delicate nostril, is something that’s too alkaline. Century eggs, as a result of they’ve been preserved in lye: This doesn’t style unhealthy, nevertheless it bodily hurts my nostril. I nonetheless would eat it anyway. There’s this Scandinavian preserved shark dish that apparently is like that.

KC: Koreans have a dish like that too, nevertheless it’s made from skate wing. It simply reeks of ammonia.

Kim, clearly you’ve integrated meals into your drag. We discuss all these meals from completely different ethnic and cultural traditions, and I’m curious if both of you assume there’s such a factor as queer meals?

KC: The very first thing I can consider is bottom-friendly meals. There are literally a number of diets and guidelines on the market for folks having anal intercourse. Excessive fiber, no dairy.

JK: Brunch to me has a component of queerness to it, just because it’s a typical time while you collect together with your chosen members of the family. The opposite factor is desserts — and never simply because there’s a queer vibe to desserts, however I do know so many cookie corporations and ice cream corporations which are headed by queer folks. There’s one thing in regards to the happiness behind them that’s engaging. I believe being queer lends you to being fearless creatively, which exhibits in any manner that you just’re attempting to precise your self. I simply occur to do it by meals. Plenty of what I do, I credit score to being a queer particular person as a result of it liberates you to be free from societal roadblocks usually related to poisonous masculinity. Folks aren’t as expressive once they don’t really feel like they’re allowed to be and queer persons are simply magically the other.

Your podcast is all about being obsessed with meals in all these alternative ways. What’s your primary tip for turning into extra open-minded and interested in meals?

KC: My factor is to all the time strategy every little thing with respect. Even when it’s an ingredient or a taste mixture that’s unfamiliar to you, don’t ever say, “Oh, that’s disgusting,” as a result of to someone else, that’s very offensive. Each ingredient has a life, and so they give that life to be consumed by you. Simply deal with it with respect that it deserves.

JK: What’s so nice about being an adventurous eater, when you find yourself attempting new issues continually, is that in case you don’t like one thing, that may be a couple of seconds of your life that you could be not take pleasure in. However in case you strive one thing new and you find yourself loving it, you’ve simply found a brand new love, and you’ll like it eternally. The danger is certainly value it, if only for the sake of that discovery. It’s one other supply of pleasure that you just’ll all the time have for the remainder of your life.

KC: Additionally making a character out of not liking issues is so pathetic. Like, “I don’t like raspberries.” Why?

This interview has been edited and condensed for readability.